Look that was meant for Coltie. I am tired of the unfair bashing the Beatles get by some people here on Listology. It's one thing not to like the Beatles but the absolute rubbish printed on here about the Beatles is immature. The comments on Sgt Pepper alone tells me Scaruffi followers know nothing about the Beatles and their music. Geez, Sgt Pepper was a continuation of Rubber Soul, Revolver, and "Strawberry Fields Forever".
You have some guy printing rubbish about the Beatles. To be honest some of us who know better are tired of the constant bashing and rubbish printed about the Beatles. The Beatles are popular and influential. Sorry that some band or artist that sold barely a handful of records did not get the attention the Beatles got. It's not the Beatles fault they worked hard and they released records that millions of people bought and thousands of musicians covering their songs. Deal with it loser.
Coltie you have not made one valid point in your anti-Beatles nonsense. Sgt Pepper was so different than what most rock musicians were putting out in 1967. You should get your facts straight when print rubbish about someone. The Beatles already put out Revolver and "Tomorrow Never Knows" and "Love You To" are even more experimental than any song that's on Velvet Underground debut album. Then again how do you compare "Strawberry Fields Forever" or the key changes on "Penny Lane" to anything on the Monks or the Velvet Underground. The Beatles were much more complex musicially than both bands combined.
I think the Beatles popularity and their influence is getting to you. It's just music just chill and get a life.
You have to listen I think the Animals studio version "House of the Rising Sun" in the context of it when it came out in 1964. Side note in America the Animals version of "House of the Rising Sun" was a number one song before The Rolling Stones scored their first hit in America. People forget that fact the The Animals were part of the British Invasion before the Rolling Stones.
This is your list and I will respect your choices and discuss the songs on your list that I really like. On the top end of your list I like the “The End”-The Doors-The Doors-Track #11 (1967) over "Sister Ray". I give you props for putting "Revolution #9" most Beatles fans don't understand what are the concepts going on with that song with it's extensive sampling, looping, both very common elements now in pop music.
Back to your list I would choose "The End" by the Doors. It's not garage rock/psych and it's really not related to British Psychedelia music. I have heard a lot of songs from the 60's and I really feel this song stands out. I am sure “Sister Ray” was a unique track but that does not make it better than “The End”. I just feel “The End” has more of what I like in a track.
A Saucerful of Secrets-Pink Floyd-A Saucerful of Secrets-Track. Nice choice
One song I like not on your list I think "House of the Rising Sun" by the Animals.
Afterhours what are your feelings on the Rolling Stones? They are a good rock band that has been overrated for decades. Since all I listened to growing up in my house of course my parent doing was the British Invasion groups I have been burnt out on their body of work throughout their storied career. In my view, their work in the mid 80's ("Undercover") to mid 90's ("Voodoo Lounge") to me is not really good.
I respect Robert Fripp on his complexity and his use of jazz with rock music. Syd Barrett for his use of avant music influences and strong use of melody. Sorry I have never liked Van Morrison so I really can't comment on him. I plead ignorance on Tim Buckley. Neal Morse is someone I would suggest. Take it easy.
One last point. One who writes lyrics is a lyricist, while one who writes music is a composer. While Dylan did both, would he be considered a great composer of music? I think some people think writing lyrics as composing music. It's not the same thing.
Robert Hunter/Jerry Garcia and/or Phil Lesh
Lennon and/or McCartney
Brian May
Freddie Mercury
Pete Townshend
Andy Partridge
Elvis Costello
John Martyn
Al Stewart
Robyn Hitchcock
Kate Bush
David Bowie
Brian Wilson
David Sylvian
Robert Fripp/Pete Sinfield
Roger Waters
Syd Barrett
I wanna say Page/Plant but they'd be accused of plagiarism.
Needless to say the only ones on your rock list I agree with is Frank Zappa and Robert Wyatt. Some advice Neptune when you debate don't talk down to people like you did with Jazz99. Jazz made valid and coherent points in which you had no answer. Then you make points by ridiculing Jazz. What are your qualifications in determining what makes a great composer? Maybe pick up an instrument and learn there is more to music than noise making like "Sister Ray" it barely qualifies as a composition. Maybe in the future answer people responses with more dignity and class like Afterhours.
Geez, musical superiority is determined how experimental the music is? Let’s judge how good music is by how avant or weird it sounds. Honestly what nonsense. Experimental or pop music if its good music and you like it that's what matters. Zappa and the Beatle come from different avenues. They had different ideas. So Zappa experimented more than the Beatles. What does it actually say? Is Zappa music better or memorable? Is Zappa music more influential and innovative? I say for me personally no to all of the above. There are more recording innovations on Revolver than any VU or most experimental musicians ever had. The Beatles arguably influenced Progressive Rock more than Zappa.
Lennon & McCartney are arguably the most prominent songwriters in the history of popular music, having pretty much changed the face of pop and rock as the world knows it today. What started as a charming, upbeat British Invasion band with infectiously catchy songs (Love Me Do, Please Please Me, etc.) evolved into something different entirely? They integrated classical composition, complex harmony, melody and musical components previously unknown in popular music like feedback, non- western instruments, and by exploring all sorts of new lyrical themes and topics (She's Leaving Home, Revolution, etc.) they created a new face for pop and rock music.
So if I like the Beatles we are musical conformists, we follow what the mainstream tells us is great. No we all don't think the Beatles invented every genre in Pop Music or Rock like Blues-Rock or Heavy Metal. Nor do we all think that every Beatles song was great. Frankly I would rather hear "A Day in the Life" and "Eleanor Rigby" to "Plastic People" or the "Duke of Prunes". LOL
I actually don't agree with you at all again when it comes to the Rock Based Artists.
You know the Beatles are part of the reason why Dylan went electric
John and the Beatles were doing things nobody was doing. Their chords were outrageous, and their harmonies made it all valid. Everybody else thought they were for the teeny boppers, that they were gonna pass right away. But it was obvious to me that they had staying power: I knew they were pointing in the direction where music had to go." Bob Dylan on the Beatles
Frank Zappa acknowledged this, that if the Beatles never happened, everyone would still be listening to stuff like Bobby Vee.
Robert Fripp on hearing the Beatles Sgt Pepper
Robert Fripp- Then I put on the radio (Radio Luxemburg) and I heard this music. It was terrifying. I had no idea what it was. Then it kept going. Then there was this enormous whine note of strings. Then there was this colossal piano chord. I discovered later that I'd come in half-way through Sgt. Pepper, played continuously. My life was never the same again.
I highly doubt that if the Beatles Revolver with “Tomorrow Never Knows” being an early example of Art-Rock and one of the first Psychedelic Albums was not a smash we never know if the Doors debut album or Hendrix would have been popular.
The Beatles in mixing pop and classical techniques, and cross-fertilizing them with Indian and electronic music, the Beatles refreshed and revitalized western harmony. They also transformed the recording studio from a dull box where you recaptured your live sound, into a musical laboratory, of exciting and completely new sounds. Sorry Afterhours like most people who don’t like the Beatles they don’t understand the history of Popular Music.
Did I say Bob Dylan or Frank Zappa were not influential? This has nothing to do with both of the them. It's neither arrogant nor ignorant that I state the Beatles were the most influential rock and pop act of the 60 it's pretty much a well known opinion. Please we know Zappa influenced the Beatles but he is not even in the same league influence was as the Beatles. Zappa influenced people like Captain Beefhart not really that influential. The Beatles influenced the following.
Frank Zappa acknowledged this, that if the Beatles never happened, everyone would still be listening to stuff like Bobby Vee.
Robert Fripp on hearing the Beatles Sgt Pepper
Robert Fripp- Then I put on the radio (Radio Luxemburg) and I heard this music. It was terrifying. I had no idea what it was. Then it kept going. Then there was this enormous whine note of strings. Then there was this colossal piano chord. I discovered later that I'd come in half-way through Sgt. Pepper, played continuously. My life was never the same again.
"John and the Beatles were doing things nobody was doing. Their chords were outrageous, and their harmonies made it all valid. Everybody else thought they were for the teeny boppers, that they were gonna pass right away. But it was obvious to me that they had staying power: I knew they were pointing in the direction where music had to go." Bob Dylan on the Beatles
Mick Jagger on inducting the Beatles in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame The reason I started writing my songs were the Beatles.
The Beatles triggered the Byrds to go the folk rock route and using the 12 string jangle sound. Not Dylan
Please we all know the Beach Boys were influenced by the Beatles Rubber Soul in which Brian Wilson says signaled a new seriousness in Pop Music.
How can the Beatles the most influential and important band of the 60's and most likely in Rock and Pop Music the last 50 years don't have one album on any list?
WITHOUT THE BEATLES NOTHING THAT CAME AFTER WOULD EXIST. Phil Spector would still be trotting out wall-of-sound girl groups, the Beach Boys would still be in love with their cars and surfing, The Who would still be doing James Brown covers, the Rolling Stones would still be an obscure R&B wanna-be and the Byrds would be a folk act.
A Hard Day's Night Album Godfather of the electric 12 rock string sound: George Harrison
Remember, George Harrison was the very first person to use the innovative new Ric 12 stringer on a record and introduced this still exciting 1964 sound to the recording and record listening world. The Byrds, Beach Boys and the newly formed British invasion regiment eagerly waiting their turn under the sun in the wings. Jangle Pop, Folk Rock and Power Pop are not the same without the Beatles using the sound first.
The Beatles "I Feel Fine" recorded in 1964 was the very first use of feedback on a rock record that was deliberate and sustained. It has since become a striking characteristic of rock music, as electric guitar players such as Pete Townsend and Jimi Hendrix deliberately induced feedback by holding their guitars close to the amplifier. Someone said "Space Guitar" having feedback but the track does not have any feedback. Also "I Feel Fine" might be the first track to combine intentional feedback, distortion with riff driven guitar part. Well basically everyone in Modern Rock uses those techniques in the course of the same song.
The Beatles Revolver has the first track Love You to be considered the first Western pop song to emulate non-western form in this case Indian Music in structure and instrumentation. With its use of sitar and tamboura played by George Harrison inspired the use of exotic guitar instruments in Pop Music. Also Revolver is the first album that uses backward guitar solo's and riffs that everyone from the Byrds to Hendrix would use later.
Look that was meant for Coltie. I am tired of the unfair bashing the Beatles get by some people here on Listology. It's one thing not to like the Beatles but the absolute rubbish printed on here about the Beatles is immature. The comments on Sgt Pepper alone tells me Scaruffi followers know nothing about the Beatles and their music. Geez, Sgt Pepper was a continuation of Rubber Soul, Revolver, and "Strawberry Fields Forever".
You have some guy printing rubbish about the Beatles. To be honest some of us who know better are tired of the constant bashing and rubbish printed about the Beatles. The Beatles are popular and influential. Sorry that some band or artist that sold barely a handful of records did not get the attention the Beatles got. It's not the Beatles fault they worked hard and they released records that millions of people bought and thousands of musicians covering their songs. Deal with it loser.
Coltie you have not made one valid point in your anti-Beatles nonsense. Sgt Pepper was so different than what most rock musicians were putting out in 1967. You should get your facts straight when print rubbish about someone. The Beatles already put out Revolver and "Tomorrow Never Knows" and "Love You To" are even more experimental than any song that's on Velvet Underground debut album. Then again how do you compare "Strawberry Fields Forever" or the key changes on "Penny Lane" to anything on the Monks or the Velvet Underground. The Beatles were much more complex musicially than both bands combined.
I think the Beatles popularity and their influence is getting to you. It's just music just chill and get a life.
You have to listen I think the Animals studio version "House of the Rising Sun" in the context of it when it came out in 1964. Side note in America the Animals version of "House of the Rising Sun" was a number one song before The Rolling Stones scored their first hit in America. People forget that fact the The Animals were part of the British Invasion before the Rolling Stones.
This is your list and I will respect your choices and discuss the songs on your list that I really like. On the top end of your list I like the “The End”-The Doors-The Doors-Track #11 (1967) over "Sister Ray". I give you props for putting "Revolution #9" most Beatles fans don't understand what are the concepts going on with that song with it's extensive sampling, looping, both very common elements now in pop music.
Back to your list I would choose "The End" by the Doors. It's not garage rock/psych and it's really not related to British Psychedelia music. I have heard a lot of songs from the 60's and I really feel this song stands out. I am sure “Sister Ray” was a unique track but that does not make it better than “The End”. I just feel “The End” has more of what I like in a track.
A Saucerful of Secrets-Pink Floyd-A Saucerful of Secrets-Track. Nice choice
One song I like not on your list I think "House of the Rising Sun" by the Animals.
Afterhours what are your feelings on the Rolling Stones? They are a good rock band that has been overrated for decades. Since all I listened to growing up in my house of course my parent doing was the British Invasion groups I have been burnt out on their body of work throughout their storied career. In my view, their work in the mid 80's ("Undercover") to mid 90's ("Voodoo Lounge") to me is not really good.
I respect Robert Fripp on his complexity and his use of jazz with rock music. Syd Barrett for his use of avant music influences and strong use of melody. Sorry I have never liked Van Morrison so I really can't comment on him. I plead ignorance on Tim Buckley. Neal Morse is someone I would suggest. Take it easy.
One last point. One who writes lyrics is a lyricist, while one who writes music is a composer. While Dylan did both, would he be considered a great composer of music? I think some people think writing lyrics as composing music. It's not the same thing.
Robert Hunter/Jerry Garcia and/or Phil Lesh
Lennon and/or McCartney
Brian May
Freddie Mercury
Pete Townshend
Andy Partridge
Elvis Costello
John Martyn
Al Stewart
Robyn Hitchcock
Kate Bush
David Bowie
Brian Wilson
David Sylvian
Robert Fripp/Pete Sinfield
Roger Waters
Syd Barrett
I wanna say Page/Plant but they'd be accused of plagiarism.
Needless to say the only ones on your rock list I agree with is Frank Zappa and Robert Wyatt. Some advice Neptune when you debate don't talk down to people like you did with Jazz99. Jazz made valid and coherent points in which you had no answer. Then you make points by ridiculing Jazz. What are your qualifications in determining what makes a great composer? Maybe pick up an instrument and learn there is more to music than noise making like "Sister Ray" it barely qualifies as a composition. Maybe in the future answer people responses with more dignity and class like Afterhours.
Hey thanks for gettting me into the Silver Apples from your 60's thread. They did some cool stuff.
Geez, musical superiority is determined how experimental the music is? Let’s judge how good music is by how avant or weird it sounds. Honestly what nonsense. Experimental or pop music if its good music and you like it that's what matters. Zappa and the Beatle come from different avenues. They had different ideas. So Zappa experimented more than the Beatles. What does it actually say? Is Zappa music better or memorable? Is Zappa music more influential and innovative? I say for me personally no to all of the above. There are more recording innovations on Revolver than any VU or most experimental musicians ever had. The Beatles arguably influenced Progressive Rock more than Zappa.
Lennon & McCartney are arguably the most prominent songwriters in the history of popular music, having pretty much changed the face of pop and rock as the world knows it today. What started as a charming, upbeat British Invasion band with infectiously catchy songs (Love Me Do, Please Please Me, etc.) evolved into something different entirely? They integrated classical composition, complex harmony, melody and musical components previously unknown in popular music like feedback, non- western instruments, and by exploring all sorts of new lyrical themes and topics (She's Leaving Home, Revolution, etc.) they created a new face for pop and rock music.
So if I like the Beatles we are musical conformists, we follow what the mainstream tells us is great. No we all don't think the Beatles invented every genre in Pop Music or Rock like Blues-Rock or Heavy Metal. Nor do we all think that every Beatles song was great. Frankly I would rather hear "A Day in the Life" and "Eleanor Rigby" to "Plastic People" or the "Duke of Prunes". LOL
I actually don't agree with you at all again when it comes to the Rock Based Artists.
You know the Beatles are part of the reason why Dylan went electric
John and the Beatles were doing things nobody was doing. Their chords were outrageous, and their harmonies made it all valid. Everybody else thought they were for the teeny boppers, that they were gonna pass right away. But it was obvious to me that they had staying power: I knew they were pointing in the direction where music had to go." Bob Dylan on the Beatles
Frank Zappa acknowledged this, that if the Beatles never happened, everyone would still be listening to stuff like Bobby Vee.
Robert Fripp on hearing the Beatles Sgt Pepper
Robert Fripp- Then I put on the radio (Radio Luxemburg) and I heard this music. It was terrifying. I had no idea what it was. Then it kept going. Then there was this enormous whine note of strings. Then there was this colossal piano chord. I discovered later that I'd come in half-way through Sgt. Pepper, played continuously. My life was never the same again.
I highly doubt that if the Beatles Revolver with “Tomorrow Never Knows” being an early example of Art-Rock and one of the first Psychedelic Albums was not a smash we never know if the Doors debut album or Hendrix would have been popular.
The Beatles in mixing pop and classical techniques, and cross-fertilizing them with Indian and electronic music, the Beatles refreshed and revitalized western harmony. They also transformed the recording studio from a dull box where you recaptured your live sound, into a musical laboratory, of exciting and completely new sounds. Sorry Afterhours like most people who don’t like the Beatles they don’t understand the history of Popular Music.
Did I say Bob Dylan or Frank Zappa were not influential? This has nothing to do with both of the them. It's neither arrogant nor ignorant that I state the Beatles were the most influential rock and pop act of the 60 it's pretty much a well known opinion. Please we know Zappa influenced the Beatles but he is not even in the same league influence was as the Beatles. Zappa influenced people like Captain Beefhart not really that influential. The Beatles influenced the following.
Frank Zappa acknowledged this, that if the Beatles never happened, everyone would still be listening to stuff like Bobby Vee.
Robert Fripp on hearing the Beatles Sgt Pepper
Robert Fripp- Then I put on the radio (Radio Luxemburg) and I heard this music. It was terrifying. I had no idea what it was. Then it kept going. Then there was this enormous whine note of strings. Then there was this colossal piano chord. I discovered later that I'd come in half-way through Sgt. Pepper, played continuously. My life was never the same again.
"John and the Beatles were doing things nobody was doing. Their chords were outrageous, and their harmonies made it all valid. Everybody else thought they were for the teeny boppers, that they were gonna pass right away. But it was obvious to me that they had staying power: I knew they were pointing in the direction where music had to go." Bob Dylan on the Beatles
Mick Jagger on inducting the Beatles in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame The reason I started writing my songs were the Beatles.
The Beatles triggered the Byrds to go the folk rock route and using the 12 string jangle sound. Not Dylan
Please we all know the Beach Boys were influenced by the Beatles Rubber Soul in which Brian Wilson says signaled a new seriousness in Pop Music.
To exclude the Beatles is pretty sad.
How can the Beatles the most influential and important band of the 60's and most likely in Rock and Pop Music the last 50 years don't have one album on any list?
WITHOUT THE BEATLES NOTHING THAT CAME AFTER WOULD EXIST. Phil Spector would still be trotting out wall-of-sound girl groups, the Beach Boys would still be in love with their cars and surfing, The Who would still be doing James Brown covers, the Rolling Stones would still be an obscure R&B wanna-be and the Byrds would be a folk act.
Well three from the Beatles
A Hard Day's Night Album Godfather of the electric 12 rock string sound: George Harrison
Remember, George Harrison was the very first person to use the innovative new Ric 12 stringer on a record and introduced this still exciting 1964 sound to the recording and record listening world. The Byrds, Beach Boys and the newly formed British invasion regiment eagerly waiting their turn under the sun in the wings. Jangle Pop, Folk Rock and Power Pop are not the same without the Beatles using the sound first.
The Beatles "I Feel Fine" recorded in 1964 was the very first use of feedback on a rock record that was deliberate and sustained. It has since become a striking characteristic of rock music, as electric guitar players such as Pete Townsend and Jimi Hendrix deliberately induced feedback by holding their guitars close to the amplifier. Someone said "Space Guitar" having feedback but the track does not have any feedback. Also "I Feel Fine" might be the first track to combine intentional feedback, distortion with riff driven guitar part. Well basically everyone in Modern Rock uses those techniques in the course of the same song.
The Beatles Revolver has the first track Love You to be considered the first Western pop song to emulate non-western form in this case Indian Music in structure and instrumentation. With its use of sitar and tamboura played by George Harrison inspired the use of exotic guitar instruments in Pop Music. Also Revolver is the first album that uses backward guitar solo's and riffs that everyone from the Byrds to Hendrix would use later.