The Mastering of Rock Compact Discs
Submitted by lbangs on Thu, 02/20/2003 - 03:16
Tags:
- Great:
- The Beatles - Magical Mystery Tour
- The Beatles - Let It Be (standard Capitol version; these two are not my favorite Beatles albums, but recent relistens prove they are well mastered)
- The Beatles - 1962-1966 (standard Capitol version)
- The Beatles - 1967-1970 (standard Capitol version)
- The Byrds - Mr. Tambourine Man, Younger Than Yesterday, The Notorious Byrd Brothers, Sweetheart of the Rodeo, Untitled, and The Byrds' Greatest Hits (The standard Sony Legacy remasters)
- The Clash - The Clash (standard Sony Legacy remaster)
- The Clash - London Calling (standard Sony Legacy remaster)
- The Clash - The Story of the Clash (standard Sony Legacy remaster)
- Elvis Costello - My Aim Is True (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - This Year's Model (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - Armed Forces (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - Get Happy!! (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - Trust (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - Imperial Bedroom (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - King of America (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - Blood & Chocolate (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Elvis Costello - The Very Best of Elvis Costello & the Attractions (standard, now sadly out-of-print Rykodisc version)
- Creedence Clearwater Revival - Bayou Country (Not the current standard Fantasy version, but the hard-to-find but very much in-print Analogue Production hybrid SACDs (check out redtrumpet.com))
- Creedence Clearwater Revival - Green River (Not the current standard Fantasy version, but the hard-to-find but very much in-print Analogue Production hybrid SACDs (check out redtrumpet.com))
- Creedence Clearwater Revival - Willy and the Poor Boys (Not the current standard Fantasy version, but the hard-to-find but very much in-print Analogue Production hybrid SACDs (check out redtrumpet.com))
- Creedence Clearwater Revival - Cosmo's Factory (Not the current standard Fantasy version, but the hard-to-find but very much in-print Analogue Production hybrid SACDs (check out redtrumpet.com); Boy, if only they'd release Chronicle now)
- The Doors - The Doors (DCC gold disc)
- Bob Dylan - Highway 61 Revisited (DCC gold disc)
- Bob Dylan - The Freewheelin' Bob Dylan (Current SACD hybrid)
- Bob Dylan - Highway 61 Revisited (Current SACD hybrid)
- Bob Dylan - Blonde on Blonde (Current SACD hybrid)
- Bob Dylan - Blood on the Tracks (Current SACD hybrid)
- Bob Dylan - Love and Theft (Current SACD hybrid)
- Buddy Holly - From the Original Master Tapes (MCA version)
- Joni Mithcell - Blue (DCC gold disc; I suspect the DCC gold disc version of Court and Spark kicks as well, but as it is very rare, I've yet to get my hands on it)
- Pink Floyd - Dark Side of the Moon (Current SACD hybrid)
- Queen - A Night at the Opera (DCC gold disc)
- The Rolling Stones - All good albums in the 2002 Abco reissue series
- The Who - Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy (Steve Hoffman mastered MCA version)
- The Who - Who's Next (Steve Hoffman mastered MCA version)
- Most Entires in the Sony / Legacy "Essential" Series
- Good:
- The Beatles - Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band (standard Capitol version)
- The Beatles - Past Masters, Vols. 1 & 2 (standard Capitol version)
- Led Zeppelin - Led Zeppelin [I] (original, pre-remixed Atlantic standard version; this version was not from the original master tapes, but from a safety copy; it is not perfect, but it is not remixed, and if you pump up the treble a bit, it is actually both quite smooth and powerful; flawed, but better than the current standard version)
- Joni Mitchell - Blue (standard Elektra / Asylum remastered version)
- Joni Mitchell - Court and Spark (standard Elektra / Asylum remastered version)
- Bad or Evil:
- The Beatles - Most of the other studio albums (perhaps excepting Abbey Road, which is simply O.K.; the early mono albums sound horrible!) (standard Capitol versions)
- The Beatles - The Beatles 1 (repeated listenings reveal bad noise reduction and processing destroying natural sound of the music)
- John Lennon - John Lennon / Plastic Ono Band (standard Capitol release is a re-mix and a horrible one at that; also very processed)
- John Lennon - Imagine (standard Capitol release is a re-mix and a horrible one at that; also very processed)
- Elvis Presley - Elvis: 30 #1 Hits (RCA version features re-mixed version of hits)
- The Who - Who's Next (standard MCA version; the evil Jon Astley has 'improved' another album by re-mixing it; he also uses way too much noise reduction, thus destroying the treble; Oh, and it wasn't made from the original master tapes, while Hoffman's version was (yes, those original master tapes Astley is now claiming to have recently 'discovered')
- The Who - Who's Next (Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs gold disc; if this differs from the Astley version listed directly above, the changes are so slight as to be negligible; again, despite what was advertised, this was NOT made from the original master tapes)
- Neil Young - Decade (standard Reprise version; vinyl reveals this should sound so much better; sounds as if Neil is playing through a pillow)
Author Comments:
I've limited this list to rock albums I believe are quite good on discs I have direct knowledge of (ie, I've listened to them with my own two ears).
I'm also limiting this list to reissues of older material, as opposed to fresh new releases debuting on CD.
More as I remember / hear them!
Information like this is priceless. Comparing different CD releases by their sound quality. I pick up reviews and opinions every now-and-again (this being the newest one), but do you or anyone else know of a website that devotes a lot of space to this subject. It's usually only when a new release is being reviewed that you get a comparison. I'd like to find a place with an archive.
I'm glad somebody finds this useful! I've picked up most of my informaton in bits and pieces and then verified or refuted everything above with my own ears. I am unaware of any great archives, although I have certainly encouraged a few members of some bulletin boards who know more than I to start some. No dice so far.
I've been tempted to type up an article about why so many modern remasterings have problems, and why some are terrific. Maybe I'll get around to it.
I'll also add that most modern remasters are made for boom boxes and budget to mediocre car stereos. When played through these systems, many sound fine (The Beatles One is a decent example). Many times, it is only when they are run through decent speakers that the bad faults stick out, and boy, do they ever stick out (again, Beatles One is a great example).
Certain remastering practices popular right now always hurt the sound of a recording. Some of this practices are dictated by the studios; some are favorites of certain remasterers.
Remixing classics, as opposed to questionable remastering practices, is absolutely unexcusable, in my book.
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
My interest peaked by your list, I went looking for some in-depth info. on the re-mastering process. You may already be aware of it, but there's a great article on the development of SACD here.
Thanks for the link! I'll have to keep my eyes (and my ears) open for that company, although the claim that the original masters aren't too necessary has me a bit suspicious. Still, sounds like an interesting system, and most remasterers could use a better sampling system.
Here's another interesting link, this one examining one of the modern remastering practices which seems to make record companies happy but, frankly, sucks.
And, sadly, there are many more where that one came from...
Thanks!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
Audiophiles should check out some of the 180 gram vinyl reissues by Sundazed. I recently got their original mono mix edition of Blonde on Blonde, which is as warm, smooth and sweet as fresh maple syrup. It is not recommended for use on waffles, however.
Ah, vinyl...
I am well aware of the Sundazed Dylans. Great stuff. I haven't really bit and bought because, well, I have really nice pressings of Freewheelin' and Highway, and while I've yet to score a nice Blonde on Blonde, I confess I don't really have much interest in the mono version of that title, although I do in some of the earlier, more acoustic titles. I've heard it, and it is very interesting and well-done, but in my heart, the stereo Blonde is THE Blonde. Forgive me.
Either tomorrow or Monday, however, I should received my Sundazed 180g vinyl Wilco Yankee Hotel Foxtrot album! Whoo-hoo!
Nice to see some props for Sundazed here. Thanks!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
I guess the next question about the stereo B.O.B. would be, "Which one?!" You've probably seen this site, but the uninitiated should check the wonderful example of obsessive Dylanology found at this web site.
I couldn't find a more appropriate place for this, so here goes, my Musical Advice Question of the Day.
I was thinking about trying a Stevie Wonder album - I looked at a few at Best Buy today. I noticed that they were recently remastered. How are the remastered versions? Astley-esque or ABKCO-esque?
Thanks for your help. I think I'll probably start with Talking Book because I love "Superstition", and I also don't really wanna shell out the money for the double-disc Songs in the Key of Life just yet.
From what I have heard, the Wonder remasters are closer to ABKCO than Astley. They certainly haven't been 'touched up' (remixed) to sound more modern. From all accounts, Wonder's albums were not recorded as audiophile albums, and even the best transfers are not going to sound stellar in that sense. Sadly, neither the original issues or the remasters are the best transfers possible for these albums, but I do favor the newer remasters to the older releases. A few of the earlier CDs accidentally chopped off some intro material to songs (!), but they did have a fuller midrange. Some fans swear by older Mobile Fidelity gold disc versions of these albums, but as you may guess, these go for a small fortune, and I for one certainly haven't bothered to nab one.
So while both are somewhat flawed, I'd probably go for the newer ones. They're probably easier to find, anyway.
I think either Talking Book or Innervisions makes for a very good Wonder introduction. His 70's work has gone the 'best of' route a few times, but nothing beats the albums. Unfortunately, his pre-70s singles has yet to see a killer CD compilation; I recently bought the excellent 3-LP Looking Back covering those early years, and I am at a loss as to why a comparable compilation has never seen the digital light of day. Oh well...
Maybe one day we'll get the Wonder remasters we deserve, but we'll have make do til then...
Enjoy!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
If you checked out my 50 Albums list, you'll see that I picked up Talking Book, which I'm really enjoying. I replaced it with a Lennon album that you said sounds bad / evil above. Do you happen to know if there's anywhere I can order better-sounding versions of the Lennon albums? Or would I have to buy them on vinyl to hear them the way they're meant to be heard (not that that's really an option for me)?
P.S. I also noticed elsewhere that you commented that Jon Astley did comparatively less damage to Live at Leeds and The Who Sell Out than to the other Who albums. Does that mean you would recommend Astley's version of The Who Sell Out over any alternatives? Or would you still suggest I try to find an unremixed version?
Terrific! Talking Book is great. If you want more Stevie, may I suggest Innervisions as a next purchase?
Now, for the sad truth; there are not great CD versions of Lennon's masterpieces available. Early discs were No-Noised to death and sound stuffy and dull, while all other releases have been remixed by Ego Ono, who will not allow the albums to be released with the original mixes (not even for the new Mobile Fidelity gold disc releases). So, you have to choose between lifelessly dull and remixed. Hardly a good choice.
From my view, the remix for Imagine is not as bad as the remix for John Lennon/Plastic Ono (which is awful). As a result, I would pick up the current Imagine and a used, pre Oh No'ed version of Plastic Ono, if possible.
As for The Who albums, that's something of a similar situation. For the most part, the 80s discs sound horrible. The exceptions to this rule are the two Steve Hoffman had a whack out (I think he also did a collection of rare tunes, but that is hardly an essential album), the Who's Next you already own and (as far as I know) all CD versions of Meaty, Beaty, Big & Bouncy. Astley remastered and remixed the discs in the 90s. As screwed up as these are, the 80s discs really sound awful, and the newer discs at least have bonus tracks.
Now, for the hopeful news. Astley's latest remasters are a step above of his 90's discs. Plus, he seems to be learning his lesson and resisting the temptation to remix. While he still uses NoNoise to the point that many songs sound sterile and septic, he is improving. Apparently, the label is going the 'Deluxe Edition' route with the Who albums, and both attempts after the iffy Live at Leeds Deluxe Edition (and the Ultimate Collection, which is a great compilation despite at times not-so-great sound (and it isn't remixed!)) are improvements. So, hopefully soon, we'll get a better sounding versions of The Who Sell Out.
Luckily, Astley didn't do so bad with Sell Out the first time, so it isn't a bad buy if you don't want to want and see about a possible Deluxe Edition. It is perhaps the best sounding of his 90s remasters, IMHO. If you go for Leeds, you might save some money by getting the single disc 1995 edition; the added material of the Deluxe Edition is largely from Tommy, and I'm not really convinced it is worth the extra dough.
You might also enjoy the band's undersung Live at the Isle of Wight album, which has a superior version of the Tommy material. In fact, the live version of Tommy here probably beats the actual studio release!
(L. Bangs ducks the flying fruit from the thousands of Who fans who love Tommy much more than he does...)
Phew! I hope that answers your questions!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
As always, thank you very much for your help. Innervisions is definitely next in line as far as Stevie Wonder goes.
I will look for an older version of Plastic Ono, but to be honest, remixed does in general sound more appealing to me than lifelessly dull. But I'll try to find that older version.
I have a copy of Tommy, but I think I have Astley's bad version - I bought it before I heard about his horrible remastering. I also have the 1995 version of Live at Leeds. Two-disc deluxe editions usually don't appeal to me (I'm on a limited budget here), so I think I'll just go with the remastered version of The Who Sell Out that's already available.
I probably do like Tommy more than you do, but I will check out that Isle of Wight album. Not till after I get The Who Sell Out and Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy, though...
"I know that when I say this, I may be steppin' on pins and needles, but I don't like all these people slaggin' her for breaking up the Beatles" - "Be My Yoko Ono", Barenaked Ladies
The search for an old John Lennon / Plastic Ono Band commences.
deepdiscountcd.com has nothing
half.com has only remasters
gemm.com has only LPs
mysimon.com only directs me to remasters
Aack, gotta go, try more later. (Maybe I can make this my first purchase from eBay... must look into that...)
You are more than welcome.
I like Tommy, quite a bit, but I tend to like it more as a collection of good (at times great) songs than as a Rock Opera. Who's Next almost met a similar fate (as a muscial entitled Lifehouse), but I'm very happy the band did a 180 and simply released it as an album.
There was a period around the late 80s / early 90s when all my friends swore that Tommy was the pinnacle of The Who, which left me (a bigger fan of the earlier work and Who's Next) out in the cold. Maybe Tommy isn't quite so highly hailed by most now...
Yeah, the current The Who Sell Out sounds like the logical next step for you. It is certainly one of my all-time favorite Who albums.
Love the BNL reference!
Ono definitely didn't break up the Beatles, and I'll even confess that some of her solo experimental work is actually pretty interesting. She just needs to get her hands off of Lennon and Beatles recordings! :)
Enjoy!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
Lbangs:
And so I return nearly four years later with a follow-up question. I want to pick up The Who Sings My Generation. Which do you think is better: this seemingly bare bones mastering or this expanded, expensive, potentially remixed deluxe edition? Or is there a preferable third option?
Sadly, there is no easy answer. The deluxe edition has much better sound, but it is a stereo remix, and for reasons concerning how the album was recorded and mixed, it lacks several important overdubs (you'll especially miss the guitar parts on the title track).
The original MCA disc is geniune mono, but it sounds pretty bad.
I'd bite the bullet and go for the deluxe edition, but it is too bad there is no perfect choice for this great album...
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
I was afraid you'd say that. Well, at least I already have a definitive version of "My Generation" on Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy.
Hmm, I also found this import that was released a couple years ago. Do you know anything about that version?
Hey lbangs! A question for you whenever you get a moment. I considered picking up Roxy Music's For Your Pleasure the other day, but on the CD wrapping there was a sticker that said, "Remade, Remodeled, Remastered" or something like that. It sounded suspect to me. Do you know if that remaster alters or remixes the tracks on the original album, or have I become paranoid?
Hey AJ!
I haven't heard that version of the album (most of my Roxy Music experience comes from vinyl), but I have several friends that swear by the standard remastered version. I don't know if that's the edition you're looking at or not, since they are so many imports of this title around. If it is simply the standard store copy, it is probably terrific. I am unaware of any CD versions of original Roxy albums being radically remixed, if that makes you feel any better.
I do know that Avalon was recently released as an SACD-hybrid (like the Stones and Dylan discs), but I don't know if this indicates that the rest of the Roxy discs will follow suit.
Good luck!
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
Thank you! I do believe I shall pick that up sometime soon.
Hey lbangs! I come to you for mastering advice yet again. Have you heard the Hip-O Elvis Costello reissues? I noticed my library carries the Hip-O This Year's Model and was wondering if it was worth a listen (I've only heard the Rhino version).
The Hip-O and the Rhino releases are the same remasterings. The former may be volume-boosted a bit, but that's it. Even the credits list the same folks.
I've recently discovered a few Demon releases of the Elvis Costello discs from the late 80s, and I think these may be the best CD versions I've ever heard of the material. Good luck finding them here in the states, though...
The Rhinos are pretty good and easy to find, so unless you're a fanatic, no need to worry.
Shalom, y'all!
L. Bangs
Oh, lame. Yeah, I haven't been particularly displeased with the Rhino This Year's Model, but I've been curious to hear what you think is the best the CD can sound. I might have to check out the Rykodisc, then.